yea we love people like you ignoring the facts aswell so you can attempt to troll a topic see my speed traps post and you can see how lewis hamilton was able to over take and schumacher wasnt.

the mercedes doesnt have the straightline speed it needs to be catching people going into corners , the aerodynamics of the cars mean you can not get close in a corner without having massive oversteer in dirty air which is why alonso couldnt overtake massa even if he wanted to put an aggressive pass on him.

watch the onboard videos of alonso struggling into the corners whenever he tried to follow massa closely.

THEN STOP POSTING BS AND TROLLING.

I thought based on the conditions, it was a nice drive from MS, he brought the car home and did score a point. He has a target on his back, and other drivers at the back surely aimed for it this weekend.

It does not matter...MS would have almost certainly beaten Rosberg this weekend. But it is ok.Bad things will not happen always.

Schumi talking on car to pit radio about his front wing problem and then a making pitstop for the front wing change.

http://vimeo.com/10500829

Why just cause i think he has made a mistake coming back? I have followed him since 95 my first year of watching f1 been a member of his offical fan club and i sill think he should of stayed retired.

Alonso seems to forget that Michael actually didn't say much. I recal from several years ago what kind of rokus there was between those two due to quali interference. Secondly, there is borderline situation when one can get punished for his actions, and/or get away with it. I am hoping next time when Schumacher hangs him on a wash line, that Alonso is not going to be too upset about it. Moreover, I am also hoping that Stewards will be just as forgiving to Schumacher whn he returns favour.

20th to 10th, with 1 extra pitstop and another slow one ...... [neither his fault]

OK, whatever you [haters] say

what a bad weekend for him, got held up in qualy and then this racing incident, without it i think he could have been on podium just look where Kubica finished, but its motorsport and these kind of things happen. Bring on Malaysia

Some of you here are so retarded. He scores decent points in his first race back after a three year layoff. He passes three cars and is very close to being fourth into the first corner yesterday before Alonso breaks his front wing. He winds up last, has THREE pit stops and still gets into the points. Two races and in the points both times, in a car that so far looks behind Red Bull, Ferrari, and McLaren. If it was anyone else you'd say their performance was fine considering car performance and all the circumstances yesterday. Pure ****ing idiocy from the usual clowns on this board.

^ Totally agree.

Hello All. im realy tired caused of this nonsence topic. Roberts Vs Schumi!!!!
okay is this a bout whos better, Whos better? and are you still questioning whos bettter, ?
whats have rosbert achieved so far since hi debut at f1, what has schumacher achieved?
thats the fact, its just a bunch of the new marvell fans.
do you call a success the positions rosbert is acquiring until now?
come on just do you homeworks. MGP maybe have a lot of things to worry about, a 41 years old fox, the allrecords owner and seven tittles achieved but out of form , and a new talent that hasnt show nothing yet. this two drivers. need to raised the game. both of them, and them you fools keep day by day.. asking whos better.
let me teel you something... when rosbert gets all the records schumacher have them we can compared. for now.. its just a crap compare rosbert to schumacher. for its like this:
level A: ( the champions )
Schumacher
Alonso
Hamilton
botom

level B ( the pretenders )
Vetel
Weber
Kubica
Rosbert

level C ( the rest of the pac )
Barrichello
Trulli
Glock
and all the others


So... just by finishing ahead of schumacher at each race.. doesnt count... its just nothing
Victories, records and Championships is that matters


regards


Alex C.

Pure numbers do not totally prove who is the greatest. Its an easy copout/comeback for Schumi fans. There is no doubt MS belongs in that discussion but saying he is the best ever because he has 7 titles is uneducated in the extreme. Stirling Moss won zero titles, that makes him a nobody who's not in the discussion according to your analysis? Same for Gilles Villeneuve....?

Senna is only half as good as Schumacher because he only won 3 titles?

listen it totally depends on the car you had - who your team mate was - and what the general competition was like in each drivers era.

Schumi's toughest opponents were Damon Hill and Mika Hakkinen - good guys and quick drivers but compare them with Prost, Mansell, Piquet, Lauda and Senna and they rather pale away don't they?

Wait a minute... this is nothing to be about whos the best ever.. that considerations arise from you.....
its just about that NUmber.. statitistic.. maybe in you world doesnt count... but in the rest yes.
at the world that im living for sure it counts

why dont you just shut the hell off. and let schumacher as it is..
just complains and bashing... i hope the currents drivers fans. have the oportunity to see theyre drivers achieve what schumacher achieved. the rest its just dreams...
lets alonso, hamilton, vetel, massa, botom and the rest acquire 7 titles and them we talk..
you heared that... them we talk


regards


Alex c.

But more importantly, intelligence loses.



Cooper

I can see it developing just like I predicted before the season. There will come 1 to 3 races where all the cards fall into place for MS and he'll shine. The rest will be so-so.

from his homepage:

"I know that might sound awkward but I take a lot of good aspects from the race weekend in Melbourne. Of course that does not show at first sight but looking into our weekend more deeply, I find we did improve quite well and have a good reason to be quite satisfied - just not from the pure result obviously. But analyzing Qualifying I think both Nico and me could have been ranked 2 to 3 positions better. I had a too conservative set up in the end which was too much concentrated towards the race, plus I had a tear-off strip stuck in my front wing which too cost me some time. And going into the race from those better positions would have meant fighting for the podium.

All that means that we are not too far away, and I am quite confident there will be more to come. So going to Malaysia we know that clearly we improved our pace since Bahrain which is a good feeling. It was a lot of fun fighting in Melbourne even if it was just for one point, and I will enjoy fighting again in Sepang. We would like to show another good race."


http://www.michael-schumacher.de/?page=new...536&lang=uk

I think Michael should have asked Fernando not in public, so Alonso's answer was the right one, he should have asked stewards directly, unless he really wanted press to be there.

On the other hand, good race for Michael. Lots of problems and still there. I know coming races will be fun to watch

Cheers.

Michael had the most overtakings on track yesterday - 8. That we didn't see most of them is because the TV director payed little attention to what's going on behind Alo-Ham-Web.

Didnt Alonso come from 16 to 4? Iunno, I may be wrong....

But yeah, the camera job on Schumi has been TERRIBLE. They need to show him up more.

Lets not rush to a judgement this early in the season but things have not started too well to for MS in fact his performance has been pretty poor when directly compared to young Rosberg. MS is a wise old fox and no mean driver so things are likely to get better but will his race fortunes improve enough to prevent him hanging up his Nomex ? I suspect if he isn't putting in good performances after Monaco he may well quit, I am far from an MS fan but I respect the guy's ability and brain power and would like to see him finish the season with at least one win and some decent points.

That was really because he came out of his pit stops behind some of the much slower cars, not really relevant one way or the other, but much to his credit he worked very hard to finish on the same lap as the "Buttoneer".
When the circus gets to Europe is when will see either the **** or the rose petals hit the fan.

if the race director would have showed schumacher trying to get past jaime you would have saw jaime pulling away on the straights because the mercedes aero efficiency is absolute crap, in the corners noone can follow another car so he had little chance.


if you dont have clean air or follow someone whos already pretty fast your whole race will be ruined no matter who you are people say well alonso climbed up but the ferrari isnt as bad on the straights and alonso still passed most of the slower cars in the pits while schumacher had to do it on the track twice.

F1 is a joke im not making excuses its a reality that will be aware to anyone who knows the sport , looks at the facts and statistics of the race. it will be come more apparent at every dry race.

its not a schumacher problem its a problem for anyone who doesnt have a clear straight line speed advantage.

Alonso really made only 3 meaningful overtakes- Petrov(behind Virgin), DLR and Barichello. He pass also Sutil but his car was not OK. He have luck to pass Jaime and Liuzzi in the box. If he was stuck behind Jaime I don't see him finishing fourth. He stay 6-7 laps behind DLR, Michael pass DLR twice(and every time for a less than a lap).

MS had 2 extra stops compared FA. subtract 54 seconds from his time [even with being stuck behind JA] ans MS is on podium.

When competing, you're only as good as your last result

I think that is an incorrect assumption. Schumacher had one extra pitstop, not two. Didnt he change his front wing and then close up right to the back of the grid courtesy the SC ??

British Sun didn't have anything much nice to say about Michael's race, call it anonymous afternoon.


________

It didn't seems to bother them that it was their boy LH who was a key participant in a jamm which forced Michael to pit three times (with slow pit lane speed).

it is not an assumption:

FA = Fernando Alonso.

FA = 1 Pit Stop.
MS = 3 Pit Stops.

3 = 2 more than 1.

make FA pit twice more than he did = 54 seconds added to his time = 10th place.

not assumptions ..... facts.

This has happened a lot of times before. The press (especially the British press) are unfairly harsh on him. Now he has new "media enemies" in the form of the Italians as well, add to that the Spanish press and we have an entire ensemble of media gunning for his head. The reports in the press are quite stupid after Australia IMO.I think considering the circumstances, Schumacher didnt exactly set the world on fire but I doubt anyone else in that Merc could have done much more in his position.

I remember reading such nonsense so many times before in MS's career. I am sure MS will bounce back and leave these guys red faced.

I never rooted for him much in his career, was always a Mika fan, but there is a bit of charm in seeing an old guy coming back to the sport against all odds. I am definitely hoping he shuts some of the stupid tabloid journalists this season.

In effect Schumacher stopped once more than Alonso, not twice. The first stop from Schumacher didn't lose him any extra time since he and Alonso were already at the back of the field with the safety car out. The second stop cost both of them the same amount of time. So now you're left with Schumachers third stop.

I don't know why you need to sugarcoat his result in sundays race; in another thread someone was upbeat because the MGP drivers did the second and fourth fastest lap. Well, duh, they were also one of the few who did a second stop for tyres!

Sorry, I didnt frame that one properly : Schumacher had one extra pitstop under the SC, which means he lost little time to Alonso there.

Michaels first stop was for the front wing and that left him at the back with Alonso, but remember the safety car came out, allowing both of them to catch up with the rest of the field, thus making one of his three pit stops irrelevant. Thereafter, Michael only stopped once more than Alonso so it would only be around 30-35 seconds lost time on Alonso. If Michael only stopped the one time after the safety car he would only have been 7th, and about 30 seconds behind Alonso on the road. So not even close to Alonso, let alone being on the podium as you said.

I think that the grey car is not really that appealling for the camera.
Even if the red helmet is still in there...

had FA not hit him, MS would have been in 4th, so the extra stop [that you say didn't make a difference] made a HUGE difference because it dropped him 16 places.
the SC period did not give him those 16 spots back, in case you didn't notice

put him in 4th on lap 1 & remove his extra pit stop on top of that and he's battling for the podium, just like Lewis.

schumacher has a cheek talking about drivers briefings. He caused 3 incidents for not listening when they were told to keep a steady pace behind the safety car. This was one of them, disgusting. Montoya and Vettel were the others.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Da0Vn_b-s18

Will be good if the press explain what would happen if Alonso didn't hit Michael, and the last year champ learn to drive better not to hit other cars like amateur? This would be more interesting. If Button was stuck behind Jaime I don't think he can overtake him even one time, not to talk twice like Michael did with inferior car to the McLaren. Everybody like to forget that Michael is not in the fastest car in the grid any more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

so now you've gone from made up facts to hypothetical scenarios. what if schumacher gave Button and Alonso a tad more room and Schumacher and Alonso raced from there with no contact?

Would you elaborate enough to explain Schumacher's responsibility in above, and how did you get the information from closed driver's session before the race?

Are you for real? If Schumacher had taken a wider line Alonso would've spun anyway. And he wasn't exactly wheelbanging Alonso when entering the corner. It's debatable wether it was Alonso's or Buttons fault, but blaming Schumacher really shows the shortsightedness and idiocy of the haters.

What if Michael was 1 meter on the left, Button still hitting Alonso , but Alonso didn't hit Michael and he continue fourth after Webber? Do you think Michael is seeing Button so much on the right. And he left space for one car. And by the way didn't Button start 2 rows before Michael, how was behind him on the first corner?

After Alonso and Button tangled by their wheels, had Schumacher passed unscaved that location, it would have had been difficult to keep Ferrari behind with their speed for rest of the race. Realistically I would think Michael had probably finished race in top five, considering RBR's misfortunes at that race.

sorry, but anybody saying MS was at fault is crazy. he gave FA plenty of room ... even seen here [after FA had been hit -MS actually gave him more room that what you see here, as FA is already sliding into MS]

fact: MS was in 4th
fact: FA hit him
fact: the SC did not give MS his 16 places back

put him in 4th on lap 1 & remove his extra pit stop on top of that and he's battling for the podium, just like Lewis.

But you remember that Alonso was at the back, Massa was already in front of Schumi. And Kubica was fourth and finished second(and Ferrari were not problem for him)? Michael have to be fourth in the end of the first lap. There is only one problem , MGP second stop. No point to think about it now. I know two other guys that a more unhappy with the season so far.

i dont know why you guys bother arguing with the trolls and baiters.

they obviously have alot of hate for schumacher and try to bash him at any point.

whole race was schumachers fault the idiot sat in a car how dare he try to overtake alonso and button! what gives him the right !

I know Michael have a lot of problems now, and the biggest is: What plane to buy to be bigger than Mr.Travolta's plane.

To summarize: Reading this and other active threads I came to the conclusion that Schumacher is guilty for everything which happened in the last 15 years and which [put you name here ...................] don't like. It is also not necessary for [put you name here ...................] to have witnessed all the events. Reading forum folklore is enough to have an unbreakable POV.

No offense mate but you can't read, at no point did I say the safety car gave him 16 places back. Also, you can't just ignore the fact that he was involved at the first corner incident because it was a major point of the race. Alonso was involved in the first corner incident too, so he dropped back and had to drive through the field along with Michael.

These are the facts of the race after the safety car pulled off:

On lap 5, the safety car pulled off and Alonso crossed the line in 18th place, 12.953 seconds behind Vettel. Michael crossed the line in 20th place, 13.958 seconds behind Vettel. The difference between them was 2 places and 1.005 seconds, so not alot between them.

On lap 8, Alonso made a pitstop, lasting 26.821 seconds. Michael also made a pitstop, lasting 29.619 seconds, 2.798 seconds slower than Alonsos.

On lap 29, Michael made another pitstop, lasting 24.412 seconds.

On lap 58, the race finished and Alonso crossed the line in 4th place, 16.304 seconds behind Button. Michael crossed the line in 10th place, 69.391 seconds behind Button. The difference between them was 6 places and 53.087 seconds, so quite alot between them.

If my calculations are correct, Michael loses 24.872 seconds to Alonso over the 54 laps of racing after you take away the one pitstop on lap 29 (24.412s), the 2.798s difference from his other pitstop on lap 8 and the 1.005s from the gap between them when the safety car pulls off.

53.087-
24.412-
02.798-
01.005
24.412

Add this time to Alonsos time interval on lap 58 (16.304s) and this would be Michaels time interval to race winner Button if you don't count his extra pitstop from lap 29, as well as the time differences from the pitstops on lap 8 and the interval on the restart from Alonso.

24.412+
16.304
40.716

This new time interval would put him in 7th place, almost 11 seconds behind Hamilton.

Race classification after 58 laps
6th L Hamilton +29.898
(M Schumacher +40.716)
7th V Liuzzi +59.847

Why does he lose so much time compared to Alonso? Both had to come from the back and Alonso was fighting for a podium, but Michael doesn't even make the top 6, even when you don't count the time lost from an extra stop over Alonso and the gap behind Alonso at the restart. That isn't all from being behind Alguersuari that's for sure, he overtook him. Rosberg was right behind Alonso at the end so it can't be totally the car. He just didn't have the pace. He should have stayed in retirement instead of coming back with mediocre drives.

Good one!!

Robracer

any chance there was further damage to his car - hence his lack of pace?