ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 13:04
QUOTE (tormave @ Jul 24 2010, 16:01)

Nico went 16.4 35.7 (green) on his last lap but drove into pits when it was clear he was through to Q3 already. Either way, they were close in Q today and Nico really needs to beat one car in Q3 to keep the old fox behind him at the start tomorrow.
This two sectors times are not something special? He did them last lap too. He was slower than Michael in S3. Car is slow in S2, not very good in S1 too.
Massa_f1
Jul 24 2010, 13:05
QUOTE (tormave @ Jul 24 2010, 14:01)

Nico went 16.4 35.7 (green) on his last lap but drove into pits when it was clear he was through to Q3 already. Either way, they were close in Q today and Nico really needs to beat one car in Q3 to keep the old fox behind him at the start tomorrow.
Big deal its his qualifying time so.
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 13:10
The truth is 1:15.0 was the best from two drivers today. How they will beat Williams, when they are faster I don't know. Williams is 4th fastest car in the moment.
SpeedyS
Jul 24 2010, 13:12
QUOTE (tormave @ Jul 24 2010, 13:01)

Nico went 16.4 35.7 (green) on his last lap but drove into pits when it was clear he was through to Q3 already. Either way, they were close in Q today and Nico really needs to beat one car in Q3 to keep the old fox behind him at the start tomorrow.
Nico faster s1 s2 but always slower s3. Did these section times in Q3 as well but could not improve his total time.
Close to equal between team mates in Qualy
GoRacing
Jul 24 2010, 13:12
Both Rosberg's and MS' times Q2 times were better than Kubica's Q3 time, Hulk also much slower in Q3 than his Q2 time.
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 13:13
Drivers did well, just car wasn't there.
At least the strategy for our masterminds at the pit wall should be clear this time. Put him on hards (you can do 2 races distances on these tyres) and drive 95% of the race on it and dive into the pits to get new SS 5-10 laps before the end.
QUOTE (tormave @ Jul 24 2010, 13:01)

Nico went 16.4 35.7 (green) on his last lap but drove into pits when it was clear he was through to Q3 already. Either way, they were close in Q today and Nico really needs to beat one car in Q3 to keep the old fox behind him at the start tomorrow.
Exactly. The margin would have been clearly bigger but the team wisely pulled him in - so the difference between the two Mercs in Q2 flattered M Schumacher. I saw the whole thing on live timing as it happened.
Still, I don't think Rosberg is exactly over the moon about out-qualifying M Schumacher these days...it is pretty much certain anyway.
Diablobb81
Jul 24 2010, 13:20
And in the end probably he will again make 4-5 stops just for the fun of it. Maybe Merc wants to keep staying the best and fastest team at pitstops. It takes practice...
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 13:21
QUOTE (Urawa @ Jul 24 2010, 16:19)

At least the strategy for our masterminds at the pit wall should be clear this time. Put him on hards (you can do 2 races distances on these tyres) and drive 95% of the race on it and dive into the pits to get new SS 5-10 laps before the end.
+1
Just not sure about pit mastermind. Can they mess again so simple situation?
tormave
Jul 24 2010, 13:22
QUOTE (GoRacing @ Jul 24 2010, 06:12)

Both Rosberg's and MS' times Q2 times were better than Kubica's Q3 time, Hulk also much slower in Q3 than his Q2 time.
All these guys (and Rosberg too) must've been short on option tyres after the tight fight for making it into Q2. Both Mercs are going to start from the better side tomorrow. Having strategy freedom will be of little significance with the temps being so cold that the option tyre wear is not a problem.
tormave
Jul 24 2010, 13:26
QUOTE (Urawa @ Jul 24 2010, 06:19)

At least the strategy for our masterminds at the pit wall should be clear this time. Put him on hards (you can do 2 races distances on these tyres) and drive 95% of the race on it and dive into the pits to get new SS 5-10 laps before the end.
Unless it gets a lot hotter might be the Merc can't get the hard tyre warm enough. If they start MS on the harder tyre he might have really difficult start to the race despite being on the cleaner side of the grid. If it rains, the even grid positions are in a lake, which might mean a start behind the SC.
dav115
Jul 24 2010, 13:29
Has Michael given any reason as to why he had such a poor S3 on his final flying lap after going green in S1 and S2? I've been away from the TV a bit so I may have missed any interviews he gave. I think he will actually be quite happy qualifying 11th (rather than getting into Q3 and qualifying 9th/10th) as it gives him much more flexibility with the tyre strategy tomorrow. Of course if it is a wet race and they all start on intermediates then that is a null point.
Diablobb81
Jul 24 2010, 13:29
He ran wide.
QUOTE (marchi-91 @ Jul 24 2010, 13:25)

The truth can hurt.
QUOTE (Diablobb81 @ Jul 24 2010, 14:29)

He ran wide.
He seems to be making a lot of driving errors this season!
Diablobb81
Jul 24 2010, 13:33
QUOTE (man @ Jul 24 2010, 16:31)

The truth can hurt.

Except that you don't know what Rosberg's final lap would have been.
They were equal in this qualy.
But the problem is the car. If Koba wouldn't have binned his final lap both would have been out.
QUOTE (Sof1 @ Jul 24 2010, 16:33)

He seems to be making a lot of driving errors this season!
Happens. But it wouldn't have been a much better time anyway. With Rosberg on a flying lap also i think the mistake made no difference.
QUOTE (Clatter @ Jul 24 2010, 13:00)

Who told you that then? He has had enough time to adapt by now, so why should there be any expectation that he will be better next year?
I'm not exactly sure. But I keep being told that.
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 13:34
I didn't see him run wide his S3 was 22,6s , not so bad? Still P11 is better than P10 or P9 I think? Will see. It is not like they lose pole here.
QUOTE (Diablobb81 @ Jul 24 2010, 13:33)

Except that you don't know what Rosberg's final lap would have been.
They were equal in this qualy.
But the problem is the car. If Koba wouldn't have binned his final lap both would have been out.
Yes...except they weren't equal in qualifying.
Rosberg out-qualified him for the 9th time in 11 races. Rosberg did his fastest first and second sectors before pulling into the pits because he was already certain of P 10 as nobody on the track could push him down further.
Cheer up. There is always 2011.
Kovalonso
Jul 24 2010, 13:38
QUOTE (pRy @ Jul 24 2010, 08:41)

MS did an interview with BBC that they just aired and the impression I got from what Schumacher was saying is that the team and car are still not built 100% around HIM but that this will come. Which to me suggests the team may well be going for a "Team Schumacher" approach next year, which after all is what people say made Schumacher who he is.. the ability to turn a team and build it around him. (Ferrari).
I feel this guarentee of support and backing is the only way Schumacher will remain in F1 as he won't be interested in playing second fiddle. It's bad news for Rosberg of course if the car direction goes totally against his style and the team build itself around Schumacher, but who knows.. maybe he will still shine. But the impression I got is Schumacher is waiting for 2011 and seems confident things will go his way.
I think there will be some debates about MORAL, if MS asks for some illegal advantages that Mercedes refuses to adopt, since it can damage their image.
And I don't think that Mercedes will agree on private information for himself, since the moto on corporations is collaborative work.
Diablobb81
Jul 24 2010, 13:40
QUOTE (man @ Jul 24 2010, 16:37)

Yes...except they weren't equal in qualifying.
Rosberg out-qualified him for the 9th time in 11 races. Rosberg did his fastest first and second sectors before pulling into the pits because he was already certain of P 10 as nobody on the track could push him down further.
Cheer up. There is always 2011.

And he could have made a mistake like Micheal in his final lap (Michael also had greens in S1 and S2 in his final lap). So you can't know what his final time would have been.
0.008 is pretty close to equal.
dav115
Jul 24 2010, 13:43
QUOTE (Diablobb81 @ Jul 24 2010, 14:40)

0.008 is pretty close to equal.
It's also by far the smallest margin between any team mates in Q2, but don't expect the haters to pay attention to that.
QUOTE (Diablobb81 @ Jul 24 2010, 13:40)

And he could have made a mistake like Micheal in his final lap (Michael also had greens in S1 and S2 in his final lap). So you can't know what his final time would have been.
0.008 is pretty close to equal.
Ok, if it makes you feel better, lets assume Rosberg would have made a mistake as Schumacher apparently did
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 13:53
If Michael finish in front of Nico tomorrow , please come back.
QUOTE (ivand911 @ Jul 24 2010, 13:53)

If Michael finish in front of Nico tomorrow , please come back.
We have a date.
But unfortuantely the stats say:
Qualifying Rosberg 9 -2 M Schumacher
Points Rosberg 90 - 36 M Schumacher
Form suggests otherwise.
dav115
Jul 24 2010, 13:57
QUOTE (ivand911 @ Jul 24 2010, 14:53)

If Michael finish in front of Nico tomorrow , please come back.
He'll have passed Nico by the end of lap 1 tomorrow. Of course I may end up eating humble pie, but meh

.
RedBaron
Jul 24 2010, 13:58
QUOTE (man @ Jul 24 2010, 13:57)

Wait until 2011. Being beaten by Rosberg is part of the plan. In 2011 I'm told he will do the business.
Worst plan ever.
baddog
Jul 24 2010, 14:00
Decent driving from both of them today, both comfortable in the car.. both let down badly by their teams apparent lack of clue about what to do with the soft tyres as the track warmed up. kicked around by the Williams.. *sigh*
Still.. race tomorrow and they are starting from positions where anything is possible except winning..
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 14:02
QUOTE (man @ Jul 24 2010, 16:57)

We have a date.
But unfortuantely the stats say:
Qualifying Rosberg 9 -2 M Schumacher
Points Rosberg 90 - 36 M Schumacher
Form suggests otherwise.
Stats didn't suggest also that Michael overtake in race Nico, every time he have chance.
QUOTE (ivand911 @ Jul 24 2010, 14:02)

Stats didn't suggest also that Michael overtake in race Nico, every time he have chance.
Mercedes are not interested in overtaking? They are interested in points = championships.
Besides, its a bit hard for Rosberg to overtake M Schumacher when he is usually ahead of him anyway.
QUOTE (ivand911 @ Jul 24 2010, 14:02)

Stats didn't suggest also that Michael overtake in race Nico, every time he have chance.
In 1988 Michele Alboreto overtook Gerhard Berger once during the season at Paul Ricard. Berger did not overtake Alboreto on a single occassion. Who did the business for Ferrari that year?
Birelman
Jul 24 2010, 14:06
QUOTE (pRy @ Jul 24 2010, 12:41)

MS did an interview with BBC that they just aired and the impression I got from what Schumacher was saying is that the team and car are still not built 100% around HIM but that this will come. Which to me suggests the team may well be going for a "Team Schumacher" approach next year, which after all is what people say made Schumacher who he is.. the ability to turn a team and build it around him. (Ferrari).
I feel this guarentee of support and backing is the only way Schumacher will remain in F1 as he won't be interested in playing second fiddle. It's bad news for Rosberg of course if the car direction goes totally against his style and the team build itself around Schumacher, but who knows.. maybe he will still shine. But the impression I got is Schumacher is waiting for 2011 and seems confident things will go his way.
Who in their right mind would build a car 100% for a driver who might not even be there 1 year after, at best won't be there 2 years after for sure. On top of that, even if you make the car 100% for him, there's not guarantees he'll be any good with it because of the age factor. LOL I'd like to see Ross make that decision
Birelman
Jul 24 2010, 14:08
QUOTE (man @ Jul 24 2010, 15:06)

In 1988 Michele Alboreto overtook Gerhard Berger once during the season at Paul Ricard. Berger did not overtake Alboreto on a single occassion. Who did the business for Ferrari that year?
Plus, Mercedes don't pay Michael Schumacher to pass Nico, they pay him to beat the field.
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 14:09
When you now Mercedes so well, can you tell me which driver they will want to make more points in next race? The driver who have 36 or 90 points. Which driver, they will want to finish better?
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 14:10
QUOTE (Birelman @ Jul 24 2010, 17:08)

Plus, Mercedes don't pay Michael Schumacher to pass Nico, they pay him to beat the field.
They need first to give him car ,that can beat the field. So easy.
Birelman
Jul 24 2010, 14:11
QUOTE (ivand911 @ Jul 24 2010, 15:09)

When you now Mercedes so well, can you tell me which driver they will want to make more points in next race? The driver who have 36 or 90 points. Which driver?
both? Did I get it right? did I?
QUOTE (ivand911 @ Jul 24 2010, 14:10)

They need first to give him car that is better than other cars and especially that of Rosberg so that can beat the field. So easy.
More accurate given the evidence.
GoRacing
Jul 24 2010, 14:13
There was nothing in it between the 2 in qualifying. In fact Nico was slower than both his and MS' time in Q3. Hope MS starts on hards and runs close to the end of the race and makes a quick dive for change of tyres. And if he does this by being 8th (past both Williams and Nico) at the end of 1st lap, even better.
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 14:13
Don't know, this is why I ask. If we know the answer , we can understand a lot of things.
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 14:16
QUOTE (man @ Jul 24 2010, 17:12)

More accurate given the evidence.
This is your interpretation. And is not good thing to change other people posts, and after this to quote them. You can just give this like your opinion.
Menace
Jul 24 2010, 14:16
IMHO Michael is looking better and better, while Mercedes is looking just terrible. The former I expected, the latter I did not.
Birelman
Jul 24 2010, 14:18
QUOTE (ivand911 @ Jul 24 2010, 15:10)

They need first to give him car ,that can beat the field. So easy.
Haha, yea, after that he'd only have the trouble of beating Nico, I'm sure between him and Ross they'd figure that one out though

.
Kompressor
Jul 24 2010, 14:19
QUOTE (Diablobb81 @ Jul 24 2010, 13:40)

And he could have made a mistake like Micheal in his final lap (Michael also had greens in S1 and S2 in his final lap). So you can't know what his final time would have been.
0.008 is pretty close to equal.

This is F1. Wins and losses and the development race are all about putting 0.008s over the opposition. If the driver can guarantee a difference of 0.008s then it's a bonus. Why don't we give Alonso the pole for being pretty close to equal to Vettel.
ivand911
Jul 24 2010, 14:20
QUOTE (Birelman @ Jul 24 2010, 17:18)

Haha, yea, after that he'd only have the trouble of beating Nico.
Yes, but this is not problem for the team? But still we are far away from this situation. Them, fighting for first position in WDC.
Birelman
Jul 24 2010, 14:24
QUOTE (ivand911 @ Jul 24 2010, 15:20)

Yes, but this is not problem for the team? But still we are far away from this situation. Them, fighting for first position in WDC.
Yea, I know the car sucks per Schumacher standards. I've always said Schumacher has never been in this situation before with a car that is not top 3. All throughout his career he enjoyed top 3 stuff, most of the time top 2.
Diablobb81
Jul 24 2010, 14:32
QUOTE (Kompressor @ Jul 24 2010, 17:19)


This is F1. Wins and losses and the development race are all about putting 0.008s over the opposition. If the driver can guarantee a difference of 0.008s then it's a bonus. Why don't we give Alonso the pole for being pretty close to equal to Vettel.

And your point is? Rosberg beat Schumacher now and has beaten him over the season. That's not new and not unexpected by now.
The discussion is how is Schumacher doing compared to his teammate.
In this qualy , although beaten, he was on almost equal pace with Rosberg. Which is a good sign for his fans.
Kompressor
Jul 24 2010, 14:36
QUOTE (Diablobb81 @ Jul 24 2010, 14:32)

And your point is? Rosberg beat Schumacher now and has beaten him over the season. That's not new and not unexpected by now.
The discussion is how is Schumacher doing compared to his teammate.
In this qualy , although beaten, he was on almost equal pace with Rosberg. Which is a good sign for his fans.
My point is that there is no such thing as pretty close to equal in racing. There is only a winner and a loser.
Birelman
Jul 24 2010, 14:40
QUOTE (Kompressor @ Jul 24 2010, 15:36)

My point is that there is no such thing as pretty close to equal in racing. There is only a winner and a loser.

Or at least that's how Michael Schumacher fans used to like it before his return so that they could claim his stats were straight and unaltered by factors outside the racetrack. Does this sound familiar? "7 championships to 0 championships" lol even if he had won them all by .0000008 they would still be claiming a vast margin!!!
Diablobb81
Jul 24 2010, 14:43
QUOTE (Kompressor @ Jul 24 2010, 17:36)

My point is that there is no such thing as pretty close to equal in racing. There is only a winner and a loser.

Well then, if that's your opinion, then all the forum discussions are pointless because in terms of only being a winner and a loser this is the only thing that counts :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Formu...rs%27_ChampionsSee you on the 14th of November.
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