Help - Search - Members - Calendar
Full Version: Mercedes GP - the 2010 Silver Arrows (Merged)
The AUTOSPORT Bulletin Board > Forums > Racing Comments
Pages: 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37, 38, 39, 40, 41, 42, 43, 44, 45, 46, 47, 48, 49, 50, 51, 52, 53, 54, 55, 56, 57, 58, 59, 60, 61, 62, 63, 64, 65, 66, 67, 68, 69, 70, 71, 72, 73, 74, 75, 76, 77, 78, 79, 80, 81, 82, 83, 84, 85, 86, 87, 88, 89, 90, 91, 92, 93, 94, 95, 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 101, 102, 103, 104, 105, 106, 107, 108, 109, 110, 111, 112, 113, 114, 115, 116, 117, 118, 119, 120, 121, 122, 123
Simon Says
QUOTE (MaxFan1 @ Nov 6 2009, 12:48) *
With McLaren and Ferrari getting rid of KERS, Brawn will be at the front again.


What? roflmao.gif

Ferrari and Mclaren are going to be more dangerous without KERS. The cars were too much compromised with the KERS system, something that Andrain Newey @ Red Bull was totally against and he was right rolleyes.gif KERS was so bad that Mclaren was the only team that fully supported KERS the entire season.

Also with integrated double diffusers instead of just putting it on the cars will certaintly make them far more competitive also.

But the real threat comes from Red Bull. Andrain Newey is going to improve his cars even more but this time also with integrated DD diffusers. Ross Brawn has to pull a rabit out of his head if he thinks he can beat the Red Bulls next season with no advantage of the DD diffuser gate.

Ross Brawn has a good car from which he can build upon so the BGP002 will be a front runner, but don't think it's going to be easy as this year was.
Ruud de la Rosa
QUOTE (Simon Says @ Nov 12 2009, 09:26) *
What? roflmao.gif

Ferrari and Mclaren are going to be more dangerous without KERS. The cars were too much compromised with the KERS system, something that Andrain Newey @ Red Bull was totally against and he was right rolleyes.gif KERS was so bad that Mclaren was the only team that fully supported KERS the entire season.

Also with integrated double diffusers instead of just putting it on the cars will certaintly make them far more competitive also.

But the real threat comes from Red Bull. Andrain Newey is going to improve his cars even more but this time also with integrated DD diffusers. Ross Brawn has to pull a rabit out of his head if he thinks he can beat the Red Bulls next season with no advantage of the DD diffuser gate.

Ross Brawn has a good car from which he can build upon so the BGP002 will be a front runner, but don't think it's going to be easy as this year was.


Mclaren didn't even run it at Silverstone if I'm correct. Blaming the system was very convenient, but I don't think that was their main problem. In my view, the former Kers cars have an advantage this year because they are more adapted to the rearward weight distribution that will result from the ban of refuelling
mstar
yer i cannot see bgp002 beating redbulls rocket ship by adrian newey and then we have mclaren and ferrari who will also be ahead.

i hope brawn at least be top 3 team next season my hunch is we be 4th best.
Matt Somers
Ledug is reporting on twitter that Becks and BWin are going to be the other main sponsors next year......
highdownforce
So... silver, orange, green, red, white, black and yellow!

How about those concerns over a alcoholic drink and a gambling house sponsoring a partly Middle East owned team?
Captain Tightpants
QUOTE (highdownforce @ Nov 14 2009, 00:19) *
So... silver, orange, green, red, white, black and yellow!

Eat your heart out, Renault.
Philzippy
QUOTE (mstar @ Nov 13 2009, 12:38) *
yer i cannot see bgp002 beating redbulls rocket ship by adrian newey



I think you're right ohwell.gif The Red Bull will sprint off into the distance... but then probably break down!
GIBF1
QUOTE (Philzippy @ Nov 13 2009, 13:33) *
I think you're right ohwell.gif The Red Bull will sprint off into the distance... but then probably break down!


lol.gif

Seriously though, why do people assume that RB will build a rocket ship? Granted there isn't huge regulation changes but to assume any team will build a good car is short sighted

Most people would of bet on Ferrari and McLaren having good cars for last season, well we know what them cars were like at the start of the season

Lets just wait until testing to see where the teams are at. (And please, no smart arse say Barcelona) up.gif

Captain Tightpants
Assuming the Orange/Becks/bwin stories are true, you know what I'd like to see on the Brawn? An asymmetrical livery. I've been a fan of the concept ever since BAR debuted it in 1999, even if the one they produced was absolutely hideous. I could see the car being orange and silver with Becks logos on one side and bwin on the other. And to help with distinguishing drivers, Brawn could reverse the design between the cars; Button with Becks on the left and bwin on the right, Rosberg with the opposite. The companies wouldn't mind because they'd be getting the same coverage owing to the reversal of the livery. Ecclestone might have issues - BAR's asymmetry ame about because he shot down the diea of running one car under the Lucky Strike banner and the other as 555 - but so long as the placement of the decals is the same, I don't think there would be an issue.
athlon
QUOTE (Matt Somers @ Nov 13 2009, 14:14) *
Ledug is reporting on twitter that Becks and BWin are going to be the other main sponsors next year......


Is it reliable? Altough AMuS reported this contract, but they didn't name the sponsors. So it could be true...
Matt Somers
He is usually pretty accurate to be honest but we shall have to wait and see....
Timstr11
Confirmed:

MERCEDES GP with Button and Rosberg.

http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/formel-...on-1476530.html

I think we need to change thread title, or start a new one?
Matt Somers
Is it confirmed they are going to change the name too then Tim? I thought they would go for an interim season TBH
Timstr11
QUOTE (Matt Somers @ Nov 16 2009, 12:46) *
Is it confirmed they are going to change the name too then Tim? I thought they would go for an interim season TBH

According to the AMuS article they will be renamed to Mercedes GP. But let's wait to see what the official press release says.
Timstr11
It's pretty certain it's "Mercedes GP".
Autosport.com:
QUOTE
Mercedes-Benz has announced that it has taken over the Brawn Formula 1 team and re-named it Mercedes GP after buying a 75.1 per cent stake in the squad.
Clatter
Who actually recieves the money, and who owns the remaining 25%?
Timstr11


QUOTE
Press release

Daimler AG and McLaren Group change form of their cooperation

Stuttgart – Mercedes-Benz will enter the Formula 1 World Championship with its own team, beginning with the 2010 season, and Daimler AG and McLaren Group will change their form of cooperation with effect as of 13 November 2009. This was announced by Daimler AG today.

Daimler AG together with Aabar Investments PJSC will take over 75.1 per cent of the Brawn GP team, with Daimler taking 45.1 per cent and Aabar 30 per cent. The rest of the 24.9 per cent will remain with the current stakeholders. With 9.1 per cent, Aabar is the biggest single shareholder of Daimler AG. This transaction is subject to the approval of the EU and the Swiss cartel authorities.

The background to this decision are the new terms and conditions for Formula 1. The “Resource Restrictions” set by FOTA and FIA effectively limit expenditure for the design, construction and running of the racing cars. In addition, there will be a significantly higher income available for a Formula 1 team generated by the commercial rights of the racing series following the signing of the new Concorde Agreement.

The partnership between McLaren Mercedes has been in place since 1995 and ended its 15th joint Formula 1 season in 2009. The change to the form of coopera- tion is taking place by mutual agreement. Mercedes-Benz and McLaren will con- tinue to co-operate with each other and the supply of engines could continue until 2015.

The McLaren Group have set themselves new targets, especially in the automo- tive sector, and Daimler understands and respects these new strategic objectives. For this reason, it has been agreed that the buy-back by the McLaren Group of the 40 per cent McLaren share owned by Daimler AG will be completed by 2011. Press Information

By taking this decision, Mercedes-Benz resumes its marvellous motor racing his- tory on the 75th anniversary of the Silver Arrows, the world?s most unique racing cars. Mercedes wants to continue the tradition in the style of these flawless Silver Arrows, which put their stamp on each era by winning the majority of the races they competed in.

“Mercedes-Benz is the most valued and best-known premium automotive brand in the world. This brand looks for competition of the utmost quality in all relevant fields in order to continually improve its performance in the face of such new challenges”, explains Dr. Dieter Zetsche, CEO of Daimler AG and Head of Mer- cedes-Benz Cars. “Due to the new Formula 1 environment, we will face the competition in future on the most important motor sports stage with our own Silver Arrow works team.

“Our new Silver Arrow Formula 1 team is a great sporting and technical chal- lenge and we will tackle this with sporting spirit and full of enthusiasm.”

Mercedes-Benz will restructure their Formula 1 programme and work hard to achieve further savings, going beyond the already completed steps for significant cost reductions and improved efficiency.

Since 1995, the beginning of the partnership, McLaren and Mercedes-Benz have competed in 256 Grand Prix events and have achieved 60 victories. In 1998, 1999 and 2008, the British-German team won the drivers? World Championships, as well as the World Constructors? Championship in 1998. The McLaren Mercedes team became runner-up in the World Championships ten times, with five times in the drivers? and constructors? rankings respectively.

After winning the drivers? title with Lewis Hamilton last year, Vodafone McLaren Mercedes finished third in the World Constructors? Championships this year. The 2008 World Champion won two races with his current car, the MP4-24, achieving a first historic victory with the brake energy-recovery system, KERS Hybrid. No other driver scored more points in the last eight races from the season?s total of 17 races than Lewis Hamilton. “I want to thank McLaren for a successful collaboration over the last decade and a half”, says Dr. Dieter Zetsche, CEO of Daimler AG and Head of Mercedes-Benz Cars. “For the benefit of both Mercedes and McLaren, we will continue our part- nership cooperation in future. We will be rivals on-track but, off-track, we will co- operate with McLaren and the other teams in order to create the best possible product for spectators worldwide.”

“We look back on 15 successful years of great collaboration with McLaren; in that time, we won four world-championship titles and finished ten times as runner-up in the drivers? and constructors? rankings,” states Norbert Haug, Vice-President Mercedes-Benz Motorsport. “Since the first victory in the 1997 Australian Grand Prix, the modern Silver Arrows have achieved a total of 60 victories in 223 races to ensure that our brand symbol, the star, stands for the greatest successes in Formula 1. We thank our partner and will continue to work with McLaren based on an excellent partnership.”

Mercedes Grand Prix, the management team of the former Brawn GP team, will continue to work under the leadership of Ross Brawn, who will continue in his well-known role. The Formula 1 team, as well as the engine team of Mercedes- Benz High Performance Engines, will be co-ordinated by Mercedes-Benz Mo- torsport, headed by their Vice-President, Norbert Haug.

“Brawn GP has been through an incredible journey over the last 12 months. From fighting for our survival to forging a strong relationship with Mercedes-Benz High Performance Engines, winning both the Constructors’ and Drivers’ World Cham- pionships, and now accepting Daimler and Aabar’s offer to buy our team, which will secure its future”, Team Principal Ross Brawn looks back on a difficult be- ginning of the year which eventually turned into an extremely successful season.

“Both I and my fellow Directors at Brawn GP are incredibly proud of our staff, drivers and everyone associated with our team and thank them for their commit- ment, outstanding teamwork and their focus on achieving results in sometimes difficult circumstances. The senior management group will remain in place to lead our team and on behalf of everyone at Brawn GP, we are honoured to be rep- resenting such a prestigious brand as Mercedes-Benz in Formula One next year and will be working together to do our best to reward their faith in our team.”

The new Silver Arrow team, Mercedes Grand Prix, will compete in Formula 1 as a works team in its own right. Synergies between the 100 per cent Daimler-owned subsidiary Mercedes-Benz High Performance Engines in Brixworth, UK, and the Mercedes Grand Prix team based about 28 miles from there in Brackley in the UK, will create even greater efficiency.

It is our target to develop a model for our Formula 1 activities which will initially be run with significantly reduced budgets by Mercedes-Benz and which, in the foreseeable future, will be self-financing”, comments Norbert Haug. “Further- more, we naturally want to inspire our faithful spectators and TV viewers world- wide and maximize media coverage for our brand. With Formula 1, Mercedes- Benz can continue to clearly demonstrate its willingness to compete and win on the most important motor sports competition stage in the world.”

Khadem Al Qubaisi, Chairman, Aabar Investment PJSC comments: “Aabar is de- lighted to join forces with Daimler AG and its world leading brand Mercedes-Benz in order to create a new Formula One Team which follows in the footsteps of the longstanding and successful tradition of the famous „Silver Arrows?.

“Ever since Aabar became the largest shareholder in Daimler AG, the cooperation between our two organisations has been exemplary, and we have already co- invested in Tesla. Aabar is confident that further successes will follow in this arena.

“Bearing in mind the recent outstanding success of the Abu Dhabi GP, which brought Formula One to the United Arab Emirates for the first time, it is espe- cially exciting to realise that next year, our own cars will be in the field, with the genius of Ross Brawn, who is still deeply involved with the team, now backed by the unrivalled excellence of Mercedes-Benz across the entire spectrum of automotive technology. It is a fantastic prospect, which makes me both pleased and proud for my country.”
Timstr11
QUOTE (Clatter @ Nov 16 2009, 13:21) *
Who actually recieves the money, and who owns the remaining 25%?

Surely the money will be invested in the team. Not into the pockets of Brawn and Fry.
Clatter
QUOTE (Timstr11 @ Nov 16 2009, 12:25) *
Surely the money will be invested in the team. Not into the pockets of Brawn and Fry.


I don't know who actually owns what there. For all I know Honda could still be the actual shareholders.
Timstr11
This was released by Mercedes GP, so it looks like this will be the basic livery from next year onwards.
Captain Tightpants
QUOTE (Timstr11 @ Nov 17 2009, 00:23) *
This was released by Mercedes GP, so it looks like this will be the basic livery from next year onwards.

It's just a photoshop of a BGP-001.
Timstr11
QUOTE (Captain Tightpants @ Nov 16 2009, 14:28) *
It's just a photoshop of a BGP-001.

I was talking about the livery.
Captain Tightpants
QUOTE (Timstr11 @ Nov 17 2009, 00:30) *
I was talking about the livery.

Too similar to McLaren.
Timstr11
QUOTE (Captain Tightpants @ Nov 16 2009, 14:37) *
Too similar to McLaren.

Silver is not a Mclaren colour but a Mercedes colour. McLaren introduced silver because of Mercedes.
It goes way back to when Mercedes had their works F1 cars which were silver coloured.
FlatOverCrest
Next Years Brawn? but now in Silver?

wink.gif

http://fc04.deviantart.net/fs49/i/2009/170...heatherlump.jpg
Baddoer
QUOTE (FlatOverCrest @ Nov 16 2009, 16:50) *

looks like honda RA108 with 2009 aero
undersquare
QUOTE (Timstr11 @ Nov 16 2009, 13:23) *
This was released by Mercedes GP, so it looks like this will be the basic livery from next year onwards.


Silver and dark grey, I always thought that would look fantastic.

And different enough from silver and red, if McLaren stay with that.
FlatOverCrest
QUOTE (Baddoer @ Nov 16 2009, 05:53) *
looks like honda RA108 with 2009 aero


Hahahah good spot sir! wink.gif
Matt Somers
Well I have my work cut out for me changing the blog across to a new name etc LOL
plastik2k9
QUOTE (Captain Tightpants @ Nov 16 2009, 13:37) *
Too similar to McLaren.

It looks nothing like a McLaren ohwell.gif
se7en_24
QUOTE (Timstr11 @ Nov 16 2009, 13:46) *
Silver is not a Mclaren colour but a Mercedes colour. McLaren introduced silver because of Mercedes.
It goes way back to when Mercedes had their works F1 cars which were silver coloured.

I thought it was more to do with changing sponsors from Marlboro to West:


The Mclarens didn't go silver when the relationship started with Merc.
FlatOverCrest
Quick bit of photoshopping.... and I came up with this....

Takes it away from the McLaren and keeps a hint of Brawn...



biggrin.gif
jps
Brawn GP was really never seen before success story in F1 history.

Brawn won both championships in every season it was in F1.

Brawn won aproximately 8 races / season.

In all seasons it had veteran F1-pilots, but always racer who won WDC with Brawn got his maiden championship.

Every year of Brawn GP career competitors whined to FIA that their car was against regulation, but it was found unguilty.

It was quite surprising that any Brawns pilot didnt continue other season with Brawn GP, even they won WDC there.

All seasons Brawn starten very strong, Brawn won in all season they drove first, forth and eleventh race, but also five other races.

Every season Brawn driver was in last race third.

Maybe it is coincidence but both in first and last season of Brawn GP, second driver won 2 GP's and took forh other podiums.
Youichi
QUOTE (Clatter @ Nov 16 2009, 12:35) *
I don't know who actually owns what there. For all I know Honda could still be the actual shareholders.


I was under the impression that Honda still owned 75%, thats what the BrawnGP accounts said in April.

So presumably, Mercedes have purchased Hondas share, and the other 24.9% is still owned by Ross/Nick Fry etc.
FlatOverCrest
QUOTE (Youichi @ Nov 16 2009, 08:24) *
I was under the impression that Honda still owned 75%, thats what the BrawnGP accounts said in April.

So presumably, Mercedes have purchased Hondas share, and the other 24.9% is still owned by Ross/Nick Fry etc.


QUOTE
"This is possible by the agreed acquisition of 75.1 per cent of Brawn GP, 45.1 per cent from Daimler and 30 per cent from our partner Aabar Investments. The rest will be with the current share - Ross Brawn, Nick Fry and other members. The interests of Daimler are aligned therefore it will be a true Mercedes-Benz team.


Fromt todays Autosport article....
FormerF1Driver
No more Brawn gp. The livery, team history is finished. Thiis is a new team. New numbers should be assigned. 28,29. Rosberg and Heidfeld to drive. The 2009 WCC are not able to defend their title. I thought we were done with this Manufacturer owned teams down.gif Its been shown it doesnt work.
Simon Says
So that's why Ross Brawn couldn't sign Jenson Button roflmao.gif

Mercedes is going to pick it's drivers very soon. Obviously Nico Rosberg and Jenson. But Ross Brawn can't make that call without Mercedes their approval so he had to wait tongue.gif

So Mercedes/Brawn can afford Kimi now. It's not a bad choice for Kimi imo.
bonneville
QUOTE (se7en_24 @ Nov 16 2009, 14:48) *
I thought it was more to do with changing sponsors from Marlboro to West:


The Mclarens didn't go silver when the relationship started with Merc.


West original colour is white and red.



West changed it's cigarette packs colours to match McLaren-Mercedes's silver theme.
And not the other way round.

Here are pictures of 1980s Zakspeed featuring West red and white livery.









metz
QUOTE (Simon Says @ Nov 16 2009, 10:45) *
So that's why Ross Brawn couldn't sign Jenson Button roflmao.gif

Mercedes is going to pick it's drivers very soon. Obviously Nico Rosberg and Jenson. But Ross Brawn can't make that call without Mercedes their approval so he had to wait tongue.gif

So Mercedes/Brawn can afford Kimi now. It's not a bad choice for Kimi imo.

BTW:
Q: There has been a lot of speculation that the new Mercedes team may field two German drivers next season?

DZ: What we would like to see would be the best drivers in the two seats. We certainly would not be opposed if one were German, but that is not a pre requisite which we would give the team.

Norbert Haug: I read some speculation and I understand this because we could not give this information earlier. But this will be an international team for Mercedes-Benz is a global player. If you look back in our history we have very often been criticised for not having a German driver, so we were always open and we took the driver decision always together with McLaren. This will be the same in the future. We want to have the best ones and we definitely do not want to have the pure German team - it's an international Silver Arrows team and we want to have the best drivers in the car.


edit: AMuS confirms Button and Rosberg. Both have been found to have Mercedes related appearances scheduled for early next year.
se7en_24
QUOTE (bonneville @ Nov 16 2009, 15:50) *
West original colour is white and red.



West changed it's cigarette packs colours to match McLaren-Mercedes's silver theme.
And not the other way round.

West just used the 'Light' colours, which I believe sell (and sold) more than the full strength ciggies so I'm not sure if you can compare the eras. People started smoking fags with a lot less nicotine and tar in the 90s which led to brands like Benson and Hedges, Marlboro Lights and West Lights becoming more popular than things like Rothmans, JPS etc.
aditya-now
Taking over from the Brawn GP / BGP002 thread, as surely the car will not be named BGP 002 now.


QUOTE (FlatOverCrest @ Nov 16 2009, 15:53) *


and the official impression from Mercedes-Benz:

QUOTE (Timstr11 @ Nov 16 2009, 14:23) *


are first ideas of how things will look Silver Arrows wise next year.
I love the (yet unrevealed) car already now, and it is amazing to have Ross Brawn at the helm of an official Mercedes-Benz F1 team!
domhnall
Is that really the official artist's impression of the livery??? They could have picked a better angle
FormerF1Driver
I think they will scrap Brawns design and purchase the Toyota 2010 designs. Good thinking.
potmotr
Nico Rosberg as a lead driver?

That is insane.
FlatOverCrest
It's gonna be an interesting year for them, I just wonder how Brawn is feeling right now? Mixed emotions? yes a nice pay cheque....but he longer has his own team and is now back working for someone else....

It's a bit of a shame as I would have loved to have seen them build their own future empire in F1...
bonneville
In terms of livery, please Merc make it simple !

1993 Sauber was cool. Make it silver and you've got a winner !

Youichi
QUOTE (FlatOverCrest @ Nov 16 2009, 15:27) *
Fromt todays Autosport article....


But Flatovercrest, it doesn't say WHO sold their share to Mercedes, hence the speculation.....
EVO2
This is really good news all round : Let's hope Norbert gets his cheque book out and they pay Jenson the right amount of money for a WDC.

If they don't and I were him, I would go to McLaren despite the risk of going up against Lewis.

After all, one or two more years in the sport at £10m pa has got to be better than 4 or 5 years at £2m pa
One
Do Merc stil have this business partnership with Xerox, this was doe at around 2001,... what about BASF?
plastik2k9
QUOTE (FormerF1Driver @ Nov 16 2009, 16:11) *
I think they will scrap Brawns design and purchase the Toyota 2010 designs. Good thinking.

Why? Toyota have consistently produced rubbish cars despite a huge budget. Honda/Brawn have produced decent cars in 2009 and 2004, and given that 2009 is now, it makes sense to continue with the 2010 Brawn car.
This is a "lo-fi" version of our main content. To view the full version with more information, formatting and images, please click here.
Invision Power Board © 2001-2012 Invision Power Services, Inc.